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Saturday, 04 May 2019

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Simples: It make "certain people" a whole *ell of a lot of money . . .

That's been obvious for ages.
Trouble is Politicians want a cause to campaign over, and have been promoting the "war on drugs" for forty years.
Policemen want something to police, preferably something that boosts their clear up rate- drug offences, like speeding offences are only recorded when there is a conviction!
Drug dealers like having a monopoly. I wonder if they are acting now like the bootleggers of old supporting politicians who promise to continue prohibition.
Legalise and the punters will get a much less dangerous supply, probably cheaper, the criminals will have to find honest work and the police can divert resources into tackling the crimes that remain in the books.
OTOH if anyone seriously wants to stop the trade they need to focus on harsh penalties for the users. Not a position many take as the users whose demand fuels the trade are typically viewed as victims. Why we should want to punish people allegedly for their own good beats me, but that is the only way to reduce the trade- like Saudi Arabia suppresses the alcohol trade by whipping any drinkers they catch.

One to watch out for with legalising is the pesky state will tax it to buggery.

That'll put the price up, and the punters will be back to thieving and robbing to pay for it all, and the gangsters black market will continue unabated.

Additionally, a market run drugs industry will be really good at getting kids hooked for life. If you think the gangsters are clever with their trendy music and video industry banging the drum for them, wait until Saatchi & Saatchi gets on the case.

Apparently drugs are really cheap to make at cost. Why not state fund production (errr, Libertarian? ... Ed) and hand them out for free in dispensers in shopping malls, public toilets, etc.?

Immediately the market price will sink to zero and the drugs industry will disintegrate and vapourize, White Walker stabbed with dragon glass style.

And what rapper douchebag is going to bother extolling the virtues of something that's no longer underground, exciting and expensive, but rather free and dispensed from a machine in a public toilet? Might as well rap about air ...

"I was hangin' wit' my bros,
In my German wit da hoes,
Den I got it in my hair,
It was time for some air."

One bro-less, hoe-less douchebag rapper later ...

SoD

You can't do much about stupidity.

"It reminds me of the futility of the old American effort to ban booze."

It shouldn't just remind you of prohibition, it is prohibition. It didn't work then, when the prohibited item was alcohol, it's still not working now with different drugs. People want them and as the learned gentleman says, governments aren't going to stop them wanting them.

Legalise them, let the government tax them and regulate their quality. That's the only role government should have in a free society.

Frank's right. It is the same ol' prohibition.

Check the timing. Big police force set up to combat booze. Repeal of the amendment threatens jobs, federal jobs especially. Can't have all those added people showing up in the already stressed soup kitchen lines so, what to do?

That said I really don't like tweekers and the like.

Now if they'd all move to California I suppose I could adjust to legalization.

It's disturbing that I agree with most of you.

Bob, chilling isn't it? Sit back and have a drink. It's Saturday night.

I am drinking as I type. At my age Saturday is just another day. Here's another angle on drugs:

"BOSTON (AP) — A pharmaceutical company founder accused of paying doctors millions in bribes to prescribe a highly addictive fentanyl spray was convicted Thursday in a case that exposed such marketing tactics as using a stripper-turned-sales-rep to give a physician a lap dance."

https://www.apnews.com/82f638d6dfcf4193ad28ddf0e65897e1

Other drug companies have been busted for this kind of behavior.

Good spot Bob.

Imagine the tactics the pharma's will use if they're given recreational drug products to invent and sell!?

Reduce the price to zero. End of market for gangsters and pharmas alike.

SoD

Where I lead, others follow! No sooner did I produce my post above than Mr. Robert Arvay (no, me neither) took up the subject at The American Thinker:

https://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2019/05/prohibition_good_idea_bad_law.html

Actually, of course, he might have written his piece before mine, whatever, he appears to hesitate at the thought of lifting the law banning drugs and insists on ever more stringent legal action against dealers including the death penalty. He seems to ignore the fact that the murder rate amongst drug dealers is enormous and it appears to have no effect on the recruitment of ever more young idiots!

There was a time in America (and in many other countries) where anyone could walk into a drugstore (Chemist for you across the pond) and buy cocaine or opium. Those that wanted the drug could obtain it cheaply and 99.9% of the population did not have any interest in it's use.

This was long before the days of an overbearing centralized federal government.

The box we are in today is that there is too large a segment of our population that is able to survive without working. To this segment, the lure of drugs is very strong as they have ample time and little motivation to resist.

I am in agreement to the extent that drugs should be legalized and sold by your neighborhood drug store/pharmacy/chemist and treated as any other over the counter medication. However, in parallel with this, there should be zero federal government transfer payments from those who work to those who do not. Everybody that is physically able has to work or the do not eat. It is a truism, but idle hands do lead humans to perdition.

Without both these things happening, there is little chance of society settling into a stable balance.

Charity and support for those who are truly disabled has to return to the local level and to the church. Allowing the federal powers to coerce the population opens too many doors for power hungry and control freaks.

"Don's tread on me" as depicted by the Gadsden flag is an historical artifact with very serious implications, beyond it's original creation. I fear we are indeed over trod by laws at the moment.

SoD,

It's too late. Back in the 1970's the powers that be thought it would be a good idea to let legitimate companies produce drugs that made people feel good without the physical drawbacks of street drugs or alcohol, like Soma in Huxley's Brave New World. Many made it to clinical trials. In the book government uses production and distribution as a means of control. So your idea could have unintended consequences.

The problem with terrapod's idea is that there may soon be a large percentage of us replaced by robots, including some professional positions in finance, medicine, and so on.

Nothing is easy.

Sell the stuff in pharmacies, takes out the "edgy" excitement of the illegal trade and unlike the dispenser idea doesn't provide anonymity. Don't tax it and limit profits.
With the illegal trade gone there word of mouth advertising will disappear along with some awful songs.
As to the unemployed provide workfare rather than unemployment pay- gives them an incentive to find productive work, maintains the skill of turning up on time, and keeps them out of mischief. I doubt that all the labour saving tech that is forecast will actually narrive, and in any case previous Labour saving innovations have changed the nature of work rather than the amount of it.
Oh and make prisoners work for their keep. Less incentive to do drugs, and it makes it easier to rehabilitate after their sentence.

Quite right. Legalise and tex. Save billions on useless policing, and raise revenue to boot. A genuine win/win.

I'm not much convinced there has been a "war on drugs", at least not during my adult life.

I attended university in the late 1980s and everyone knew the places to go to buy. it was on the route to my shared house and we had to walk past street corner dealers. At first it was a novelty. They approached us to find out whether we wanted to buy but after a few days they knew were not in the market and ignored us. Over the weeks we saw the routine. The guy who approached you had nothing with him, but if you bought, then a second chap would get out of a car round the corner and hand over the goods. Younger kids would be hanging around a couple of hundred yards away - they would be lookouts and warn if a police car came close. When one did, the drug car generally drove off for 10 minutes. The police would get out of the car on occasion and chat to the dealers it was obvious what was going on but I never saw an arrest or even a search. If they had wanted to they could have sprung a trap.

On the other hand there was war going on between different gangs trying to control territory. There were two shootings while I lived in the area. One at a "Blues Party" and a second at a "Patty Shop". A young bystander was killed at the latter and all hell broke loose for a fortnight. The police were out in force, questioning everyone and searching many. Now there were arrests. This is also when the student rag took an interest. Apparently the police were being racist twice over - first, for a black kid being killed and doing "nothing about it" and second, for questioning and arresting black kids. I never managed to square that one.

If we were going to have a war on drugs then we would need to be serious about it. Go after the big dealers of hard drugs, track them back to the source and close the routes. We won't do that because the establishment long ago gave up the fight.

So we must legalise the softer drugs, at least, but I make one demand: currently a burglar may claim they commit crime to feed a habit - the drugs control their habit. This excuse is trotted out because it works. Responsibility and self control are regarded as something only the elite can possess. The rest of us are unwilling pawns of malign forces like, big tobacco, big pharma, big alcohol, big sugar, big . That has to end. So I demand - if you break into a house and claim the drugs "made me do it" then your sentence is automatically doubled.

It won't happen because it doesn't fit with the prejudices of the ruling classes

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